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Further Criticisms regarding "Six or Eight Days of Creation"


Topic Under Discussion
Six or Eight Days of Creation


Question
QuestionfromAustria

Assalam Although you have cleared up some things in your previous response, Mr. Sina, whom I forwarded your reply, still had to object against one or more points in your elucidation. As you've already explained anyone may accept or refuse your explanations, but this time Mr. Sina raises a completely different objection. He asserts that when the word "thumma" is used in a sentence where the subject matter is time, then the word "thumma" can only implicate "then". Is this correct? Mr. Sina writes: "As it is clear Mr. Amjad is trying to convince himself that the 2 days that it took to create the Earth is part of the 4 days that it took to create the mountains and other things. To do so Mr. Amjad insists that "thumma" in Arabic, which is equivalent to "then" in English does not indicate sequence and order of events. To prove his point he quotes examples in English and in Arabic where "then" and "thumma" do not indicate sequence of events but mean:  "and", "plus", "in addition", "furthermore", "also" "moreover", "therefore", "in that case", etc. That is true! "Then" and "thumma" could mean all those things. However in all these examples that "then" and "thumma" do not indicate sequence of events, TIME is not the subject matter. But when TIME is the subject matter, both "then" and "thumma" invariably indicate sequence of events. So if I say I framed a house in one month THEN I completed it in 6 months that "then" indicates sequence and should be translated as after that, next, afterward, subsequently, followed by, etc. If I had said, "I framed a house in one month AND finished it in 6 months, then that could be also interpreted as if the one month of framing is part of the 6 months of completing the house. However the Quran does not say "Wa" (and), it says "thumma", which means "then" and that can only be interpreted as sequence of time. If I tell you that this morning I woke up, then I took a shower and shaved, then I had breakfast, then I went to my office. You have no doubt about the sequence of events. I could not have gone to my office or showered before waking up. The "then" makes it clear which event precedes which. But when I said I took shower and shaved you don't know which one I did first because I did not use "then". I could have shaven before, at the time that I was showering or after that. That sequence of events is not clear. In all other cases, there is no doubt which event took place first and which one took next. In the Quran verse 41:9-12 we have a series of events that are separated from each other by "thumma". Since those verse describe the time that took each event, that "thumma" indicates sequence of events and nothing else.  This is such a simple mater that I am even surprised why we should argue about it. Anyway, Mr. Amjad not only failed to acknowledge his error, he avoided altogether the most important part of my response that had nothing to do with numbers and grammar but with science and logic. The Quran says that the creation of the Earth precedes the creation of the heavens (or the firmaments). We know absolutely that is not the case. The Earth is part of this universe and the part could not have been created before the whole. The big bang that gave birth to this universe took place billions of year prior to the formation of our Sun and our Earth. This is the most obvious error of this verse. Mr. Amjad completely ignores this point and does not even mention it. Although he is good in giving some absurd answers to any question for the sake of just having said something, can he explain this difficulty? It would be fun to watch him waddle out of this quagmire."

Answer
I do not desire to comment directly on the cited writing. However, I shall insha'Allah try my best to answer any questions that the writing may have raised in your mind. Please send me the specific question that has arisen in your mind and which you want answered.




Answer published by Moiz Amjad


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